Author Topic: A Fishy Fish?  (Read 20628 times)

Jon Brooks

  • Registered Member
  • *
  • Posts: 163
    • View Profile
A Fishy Fish?
« on: July 16, 2010, 10:26:24 PM »
I came across this picture of a 1978 Fish reproduction made by Golden Era Boats down in Noank, CT. 



Notice the bow?  It doesn't have that lovely sweeping curve of the original Fish Class "Wanda"(For Sale Section).

Were all the Fish Class boats built like "Wanda"?  Did some have the straightened bow?  If so, why?  And if not, why does the Golden Era mold have a straightened bow?

Jon   8)

Steve

  • Administrator
  • Registered Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 804
    • View Profile
Re: A Fishy Fish?
« Reply #1 on: July 16, 2010, 10:34:46 PM »
All of the HMCo Fish were built from the same molds and should have the same bow profile.  I don't know why this adjustment would have been made.  In some cases, the shapes are modified somewhat when building in fiberglass to make extracting the hull from the mold easier.  Maybe it has to do with that ?

Adam

  • Administrator
  • Registered Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1378
    • View Profile
Re: A Fishy Fish?
« Reply #2 on: July 17, 2010, 03:02:33 AM »
Actually I think that is just a bad picture - angles and all. These were made By Robert Champlain and are quite well made - and it is my understanding they are "exact" reproductions (well, in fiberglass). He made these in the 70's and I think into the 1980's. He is still around - known for his Stonington pulling boats. He still deals in the "Petrel" as a used broker. See - http://www.theboatguys.com/index.htm

He and I almost contracted to re-do a one off 26 footer he built in the early 1980's. It was based on FANO - as he put it a goldeneye with a 12 1/2 rudder hung stern. She was high end but needed a complete re-build. He called her ORIANA. It ended up too much for me to do - and I bought WINSOME instead. I have lots of pics on my flickr site of her....

ORIANA:


Jon Brooks

  • Registered Member
  • *
  • Posts: 163
    • View Profile
Re: A Fishy Fish?
« Reply #3 on: July 17, 2010, 02:25:58 PM »
I don't know.  I've found other "Petrel" pics showing a straighter bow, but none on the original Fish.  Steve might be right about the molding, or they used an improperly rebuilt boat for the plug?  I do like that fiberglass whitehall he's got listed.  That might be what I've been looking for!

Jon   8)

Adam

  • Administrator
  • Registered Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1378
    • View Profile
Re: A Fishy Fish?
« Reply #4 on: July 19, 2010, 08:26:24 PM »
No, no - Your looking for a Haven 12 1/2.... :P

umills

  • Registered Member
  • *
  • Posts: 3
    • View Profile
Re: A Fishy Fish?
« Reply #5 on: July 24, 2010, 01:21:42 PM »
We have one Petrel and 3 Pisces 21 at Seawanhaka Yacht club and the bow of the Petrel is  straighter than the bow of the Pisces.they of course are not actual Fish class boats but ''renditions"

JimNewman

  • Registered Member
  • *
  • Posts: 2
  • Owner of FELICITY, HMC Fish Class Sloop
    • View Profile
    • Felicity
Re: A Fishy Fish?
« Reply #6 on: July 24, 2010, 01:59:05 PM »
I have always assumed that the Golden Era Petrel had a straighter bow than a proper Fish to reduce the likelihood of lawsuits from the rightful owners of the design. 

Adam

  • Administrator
  • Registered Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1378
    • View Profile
Re: A Fishy Fish?
« Reply #7 on: July 25, 2010, 04:18:40 AM »
Hmmm....I'm sure he told me they were the same as the originals - but I must be mistaken! I'll ask him one of these days and get the scoop on the why....

Anyone know who would "own" the design to the Fish? It's one of the small boats that I dont believe is under CCSB "contract" - Which I believe states: "the exclusive rights to build Herreshoff 12 footers, S Boats, Fishers Island one design, and the boat Nathaniel Herreshoff designed as an improvement on the 12 footers." (I believe that improvement must be FANO, IE the Goldeneye based on the builder record notes we discussed in an earlier post).

Steve

  • Administrator
  • Registered Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 804
    • View Profile
Re: A Fishy Fish?
« Reply #8 on: July 25, 2010, 11:37:02 AM »
I don't believe that anyone owns the rights.  As you note, contrary to popular opinion, CCSB does not have a claim to the Fish.  I don't know what drawings MIT may have.  The challenge you may run into is that the Fish was based on the same model as the 12 1/2.  If I'm not mistaken, they used the same offset booklet as well, scaling up the figures as appropriate when building the molds.  That offset booklet, I would presume, is covered by the CCSB agreement and is most likely in their possession.

Erick Singleman

  • Registered Member
  • *
  • Posts: 172
    • View Profile
    • Erick's Wooden Boat Pics
Re: A Fishy Fish?
« Reply #9 on: August 05, 2010, 05:24:57 PM »
I believe I read somewhere that in addition to scaling up the 12 1/2 offsets, the stem  profile was elongated a bit as is evidenced by comparing the two bows.
The wife says I can have a mistress as long as her ribs are made from white oak.

Steve

  • Administrator
  • Registered Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 804
    • View Profile
Re: A Fishy Fish?
« Reply #10 on: August 05, 2010, 05:57:53 PM »
Both the 12 and the Fish were built from the same model.  In the case of the 12, it was scaled at 1:10.  In the case of the Fish, the sections were scaled at 1:12 and the lengths were scaled at 1:13.  In addition, an extra 3-1/2 inches was added to the Fish deck at the bow end, which is probably what Erick is referring to.