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Messages - Charles Barclay

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Specific Herreshoff Vessels / Re: renovation
« on: March 17, 2019, 10:18:45 PM »
We need more information to assist in identification. 

HMCo built more than a dozen S-Boats (27.5' LOA, 20' LWL) in 1926 and a few 24' LOA Buzzards Bay/Newport 15's.  Neither are quite 26'.

You are more likely looking at a LF Herreshoff design. 

A picture, name, class, builder, or something more illuminating is necessary to assist.

Restoration / Re: Paint restoration over canvas
« on: January 28, 2019, 07:35:55 PM »

Great question(s). 

Painted canvas creates a non-skid surface. 

Deck materials have evolved quite a bit; however, plywood under the canvas may well be original depending on the vintage Herreshoff 12 1/2.  Plywood was introduced in the 30's but became much more prominent post WWII as the war helped improve ply technology.  Plywood would be used for structural elements like bulkheads.  PT boats were made with plywood.  Post war, Luders 16 and 24 race boat hulls were made with hot molded plywood.  Many of these 70 year old boats are still viable today.  As with planked boats off season storage and routine maintenance practices are key to long term viability. 

You have several choices of plywood including one formulated for the marine environment.  Marine Ply is your best (only good) choice for decks, bulkheads or any surface exposed to the elements. 

The original decks were canvas.  Lead paint was used to bed and coat the canvas over both planked and ply decks.  Lead paint is toxic by today's standards and proper care should be used in working with it including sanding and disposal.  This means a respirator and gloves and sweeping/vacuuming the debris. 

The other problem with sanding the painted canvas is ruining the non-skid surface.  If you are a painting newbie, you are probably also a foredeck newbie.  Non-skid surfaces are critical safety gear for that reach to reach spinnaker jibe at the wing mark in big breeze!  Not that you would ever do such a thing, but knowing you can is critical. 

Seriously, restoration/replacement is not that big of a deal.  You can source Dynel fabric which mimics texture of canvas at Jamestown Distributors.  It's a DIY thing.  You can also use the plywood or sand and fill the existing surface with thickened epoxy (using microballoons and thicksil) then use interlux deck particles or another similar anti-skid material or even Kiwi Grip on the deck if you are not doing a museum quality restoration. 

Dynel has been the choice I've seen most frequently for good looking, durable, well used decks. 

Good luck,


Herreshoff Boats For Sale / Re: NY 40 in Hawaii
« on: January 28, 2019, 06:30:22 PM »

Thank you for pointing out the similarity in 'asking' prices.  After speaking with the listing broker and reviewing the Yachtworld listing, it is worthwhile noting the asking price of The Wizard of Bristol includes delivery anywhere in the world which addresses the concern addressed in the original post. 

With regard to the rig, Marilee's 2016-17 restoration took the novel approach of building the class original gaff rig, and the following year a racing marconi rig updated by LFH (1936).   One of the photos on the Wizard's yacht world page shows the 30's vintage marconi rig.  Marilee's owner changes rigs based on the perceived advantage for the upcoming season/events. 

With regard to the bulwark, I don't believe the intent for this restoration was to race the boat on the Newport-Antigua-Med circuit.

Are you still actively involved with Chinook? Perhaps you could share insights on your choice of location for restoration, hull shape, and project management.


Miscellaneous Herreshoff Topics / Re: bridge clearance for a HA-18
« on: December 09, 2018, 08:46:22 PM »
Sailboat tends to be a useful source for basic model data.  The Herreshoff America is here:

It does not include clearance information. 

Does anyone have this data to help? 

Herreshoff Boats For Sale / Re: NY 40 in Hawaii
« on: November 13, 2018, 09:54:48 PM »
Hi Rob,

The boat is for sale on yacht world and has been for about two years. 

The hull is sound, having been rebuilt by Eric Ashford of Port Townsend.  Eric does solid work.  I recall the planks may be edge-glued rather than caulked.  If you look closely at the photo posted on the Forum in October the hull is fairly smooth.  I knew Eric in the 90's and would run into him from time to time in the 2000's.  Neither the owner nor restorer were/are permanent residents and so the work on the Wizard would start and stop. 

The major challenge may be transporting the vessel from Hawaii to the mainland.  This challenge can be overcome. 

Having sailed on the vessel in 1999 or 2000, I can answer some questions as well as put interested parties in touch with the owner's representative.  Wizard's owner also has two significant Alden's in the 50-65' range LOD and would like to place the Wizard in the hands of someone to finish the restoration as he downsizes his fleet. 

PM me or feel free to ask more questions on this thread. 

Specific Herreshoff Vessels / Re: Queen Mab
« on: November 06, 2018, 03:35:58 PM »
Possibly, or Sailing Yacht.

Today we use S/V for Sailing vessel and M/V for Motor Vessel. 

Specific Herreshoff Vessels / Re: Queen Mab
« on: November 03, 2018, 10:33:57 PM »
Being a reference to a fairy in Shakespeare play, there have been many Queen Mabs. 

The Herreshoff built schooner was two masted.

Got word today via text message.  Location:  Ala Wai Small Boat Harbor. 

Restoration / Re: Lucky Pierre's #966 Structural Restoration
« on: January 11, 2017, 07:30:53 PM »

You have taken Lucky to the right place.  Jens is a quality. 

Herreshoff Boats For Sale / Re: FISH for sale?
« on: December 24, 2016, 09:25:15 PM »
Alec at Artisan Boatworks in Rockport, ME finished restoration of a Fish earlier this year.  Check their FB page or website.

Start at Artisan, Herreshoff Yacht Sales sold one two years ago to a couple in Brooklin, ME, second place to inquire.  Be prepared to wait for one to become available. 

Having watched the Pisces Class boats race and day cruise this summer from atop the RC Boat, the modified marconi rig of the newer Pisces is a sweet little adaptation.  A Pisces may be a reasonable place holder until one becomes available. 

Specific Herreshoff Vessels / Re: Vitessa
« on: July 09, 2016, 09:52:24 PM »
Vitessa is a yawl rigged Buzzards Bay 25, #734.  Owner had her prepped and rigged at Boothbay Harbor Shipyard this spring and launched early May, Vitessa has a standard beige canvas deck.  No engine. 

Along with Vitessa was launched a reproduction sloop rigged sistership with a teak inlaid deck.  Yard Manager informed me, one of the two was for sale. 

Specific Herreshoff Vessels / Vitessa
« on: July 09, 2016, 03:27:42 AM »
6/6/2016  Boothbay Harbor, Maine.

Herreshoff Sailing Vessel Classes / Re: New Herreshoff 12 1/2 owner
« on: January 31, 2016, 11:29:48 PM »
Hi Ray,

The industry standard is, regardless of builder, the designer pedigree takes precedence.  For example, all J24's are considered J24's regardless of who builds them.  From Wikipedia:

The J24 designed by History[edit]
In the summer of 1975 Rodney Johnstone designed and built hull number 1 in his garage in Stonington, Connecticut. "Ragtime" would serve as the master mould for the subsequent hulls. This design allowed him to start the very successful J-Boat company with his brother Bob Johnstone. By 1978 the class was popular enough to hold a one-design regatta in Key West with twenty boats on the line.[citation needed]
Early boats (hull numbers up to 3000) need a lot of work to rebuild their keel shape (move material forward) to make them point and sail fast in light wind. These older boats can be modified if one wants a competitive J/24. New boat manufacturing is done by multiple companies around the world in France, USA, Italy and Argentina.[9] In the US, J/24's are built by US Watercraft.
As of January 2009, approximately 5,475[10] J/24s have been produced. Approximately 20 new boats were produced in 2008. The average price of a complete, new boat without sails was approximately 20,000. (31,370 USD)[10]

No one would dispute a J24 built by US Watercraft is less of a J Boat than an original.

Interestingly, HMCo developed a reputation as a builder so that many boats designed by others and built at Herreshoff today, are lazily called a Herreshoff rather than an Alden built by Herreshoff or Herreshoff-built Burgess.  Some like the MIT dinghies, designed by Owen, are now just "Tech's".   

Wouldn't worry about it too much.  The boats with the builder's plates are real Herreshoff. 

Far less fortunate in providing provenance of origin are those with boat's whose builder plate has been removed.


Herreshoff Sailing Vessel Classes / Re: New Herreshoff 12 1/2 owner
« on: January 24, 2016, 12:42:21 AM »
Good snowy afternoon Adam, Ray;

I have a different take on whether Ray's Quincy Adam built 12 1/2 is a true Herreshoff. 

I believe the boat is a true Herreshoff for the following reasons:

1.  The boat was designed by Herreshoff Manufacturing Company (HMCo) designers in 1914 and refined at various times by Herreshoff designers.

2. In 1943 it was a standard business practice to license the manufacture of a good or product.  Alden, LFH, and other designers without a manufacturing capability contracted boats for build by various yards.  No one would look at a Sound Interclub for example and call it anything other than a Sound Interclub based on where it was built. 

3. HMCo benefitted by receipt of a license fee from the build and sale of boats by the QA Yard. 

4. Ray's boat has an HMCo builder's plate on the transom.  If HMCo authorized a builder's plate, it was indeed a Herreshoff.

Somewhere in the MIT files is evidence of HMCo sending personnel from Bristol to Quincy to verify the build process met Herreshoff standards. 

A contemporary example would be Coach, Inc. the maker of fine leather goods, founded in 1941.  It made most but not all of its products in the 1940's, today it designs, promotes, advertises, distributes, and sells---but produces nearly all its products today under contract by firms not owned by Coach.  No one disputes they are Coach. 

To summarize:  HMCo authorized and licensed the build of Ray's boat.  HMCo benefitted from the build.  HMCo likely took action to verify as-built standards.  HMCo allowed it to be stamped a "Herreshoff".  Therefore it's a Herreshoff.

This begs the questions about the non-HMCo built S-Boats from Lawley and US Navy.  I believe the 7 Lawley built boats were built under license, but the USN boats were not.  Yet the USN boats raced against the Herreshoff boats as one-design class as did the Lawley boats.  For the sailors, they were all Herreshoffs.   



Here is a used set on Craig's List:

he has an aluminum pole too.  So you might want to avoid it altogether and go new:

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